Date: Thu, 11 Apr 1996 19:25:05 -0400 From: NCreed@aol.com To: 102125.3126@compuserve.com, 103450.3521@compuserve.com, 72650.74@compuserve.com, ahunter@freenet.vcu.edu, ALABAMA233@aol.com, BKeys26433@aol.com, BLACK@globe.com, burnett@kaizen.net, cdorian@accessone.com, cgaunt@umich.edu, ChickFlet@aol.com, chlamy@acpub.duke.edu, CHRISTIEFC@aol.com, connie.spaw@cbis.com, CW1210@aol.com, davidcon@microsoft.com, dfullam@albany.net, DP6195@aol.com, ekirkman@swva.net, hoffman@gate.net, IRXP500@indyvax.iupui.edu, jlampkin@selu.edu, JMarieCox@aol.com, Knights5@aol.com, lrd@ornl.gov, Majie@sava.gulfnet.com, marockem@minot.ndak.net, mcclaran@ionet.net, mlsaps@mcn.net, N4JED@aol.com, NCreed@aol.com, Pat-Chesney@easy.com, PWhetzel@aol.com, rhobson@sdcoe.k12.ca.us, ross@interramp.com, rsimms@math.clemson.edu, shauck@d.umn.edu, turner@mind.net, waddiesalmon@usa.pipeline.com, WittBates@aol.com, wjarrell@phoenix.phoenix.net Subject: TURNER-BURNETT-VIA-ROSS-ETC/ETC COMPILATION #10 Hello to Everyone: 11 April 1996 Chris Gaunt has been faithfully adding our compilations to her home page. This will be compilation number 10. If you haven't checked out Chris' homepage lately, you'll find something new. A search of all our compilations. Hopefully, we'll hear from more folks researching our lines as a result of the TURNER-BURNETT- VIA-ROSS-ETC/ETC information that Chris is maintaining. http://www-personal.umich.edu/~cgaunt/etc/etc.html Again. Thanks for sharing your information. I'm convinced we'll all benefit by this exchange. Nyla Creed DePauk Vienna VA ========================================= Subj: Turners on Mayflower Date: 96-04-05 09:30:23 EST From: Pat-Chesney@easy.com (Pat Chesney) Hi, Nyla and fellow Turner researchers. Just wanted to follow up on Phillips comments about the family of John Turner on the Mayflower. Yes, I knew that he and his two sons died that first winter after arriving but in my research to see why there would be so strong a story in my family that we were related to this family I turned up some interesting facts. The following one I just learned recently that this story also appeared in another Turner family and was stated in a magazine or book article long ago. My sister who has been doing some research for me at the Austin library sent the following several letters which I include but have taken this part out and highlighted. This is an entirely different line coming down then my Turners but has same story. I also found other information that makes for the * possibility * of the story being true. This article also states the possibility that the **** tradition ****in one family is that the son or grandson of John Turner, Mayflower Pilgrim,**** was one of the first settlers in New Haven, Conn. His name was Nathaniel Turner Other info I have found - John Turner was a widower before the voyage. He brought two sons with him. Neither their age nor their names are listed. I would assume they might have been younger then 12 since they are not named and older then 4 yrs since their father took them without a wife. A daughter comes over later and marries but doesn't leave any children behind. Could there have been other children left behind? If there were other children left behind whose family would they have been put in? I believe they would have been put with relatives that were also of the Separatist belief. Since John Turner may have come from the same place as Brewster and the other pilgrims in England and also appears to have gone to Leyden Holland, his family, including relatives of same belief, would have been close to the Separatists that did make it to the new world. I found that eight yrs after the pilgrims arrived - a Humphrey Turner comes to Plymouth. In one place it says he had several, maybe as many as four John Turners in his household. He is listed in several places as having two Johns for his first sons. That is very unusual and they are pretty far apart in age not just a few yrs. They obviously grew up together because one is called John the eldar to differentiate him from his younger brother - John the younger. This older John marries into the most important family in Plymouth - William Brewsters - marrying his granddaughter Mary Brewster. For this to happen means the family was well recieved by the Brewsters - one with them in their beliefs and possibly well known by the Brewsters before they came to the new world. To find that this Humphrey Turner's descendants, in more then just my family line, claim to be related to the Turners on the Mayflower, makes me feel like there is a possiblity that Humphrey could have been related to the Turners that came over eight yrs before and died that first winter. Perhaps he even had one of John's sons with his family or was someway related. Humphrey also named a son Nathaniel. So the Nathaniel mentioned that says he was descendant of the John Turner on the Mayflower might possibly be related to the Humphrey Turner family in some way also. Remember how few Separatists there were in England and how they would have clung together if their family were in the same church. I believe there is a possibility that John Turner on the Mayflower might have left another child behind besides his daughter and that child might have been raised by a relative. Or that John Turner on the Mayflower might have had relatives that came a few yrs later and claimed to be related or descendants of that Turner family on the Mayflower. Or the story could come from the John Turner the eldest son of Humphrey marrying into William Brewsters family and claiming they were from Mayflower people - but the story in my family and in that other is that they are descendants of the John Turner on the Mayflower!! If any other Turner researchers have anything to add along these lines I am obviously interested. My William S. Turner told this story to his family and it was passed down in writing and by word of mouth. Also the part about being related to James Turner the governor of NC. I found that information to be true so gives me hope for the other being true also. But I do know that no one has ever been able to prove it. Perhaps as more people research this Mayflower group new research will turn up more information that might help understand the relationships between the people back in England and their family lines. So if anyone has anything or knows of a good source to search let me know! On with what my sister sent me - If you can find the book, Signers of the Mayflower Compact, the article is on page 22 and is quite informative. You do know that a John Turner married Mary Brewster Nov. 12, 1645. This may be where the confusion is coming from about the Brewster line. This John Turner's father was Humphrey Turner of Scituate. One book we found even said that his wife had come with him on the Mayflower, but that is hard to believe with no listing of her on the passenger list, even if whe died on the trip over. They do give the neme of the town he came from before the trip, being Leyden, Holland of the Netherlands. We forgot to write down the name of the book that we got this info. out of, but will try to find it the next time we go. This is what was written: John Turner with wife and 2 sons came to Plymouth and are classed with the Leyden contingent. All died in the first winter, but a daughter came some years after to Salem and married there.(Bradford) Her identity has not been established. I INSERT HERE A LATER BIT OF INFORMATION We did find a treasure. One book showed the name of his daughter (Signers of the Mayflower Compact)as Marjorie who married the first Richard Paul in 1638. They place her in Salem, Mass. This article also states the possibility that the **** tradition ****in one family is that the son or grandson of John Turner, Mayflower Pilgrim,**** was one of the first settlers in New Haven, Conn. His name was Nathaniel Turner. One of descendants, a first settler of Hartford, Conn.-from there John Turner also a descendant-went to Norfolk, Conn. and was one of the first settlers there about 1758. In connection with the above, there is some Pilgrim evidence in the fact that the Windsor, Conn., Browns who are supposed to descend from Peter Brown, went as was natural under such circumstances, to Hartford and Norfolk, Conn., as well, with the Turners. The authors attention was called to "Historical Collections of Grantham, England," by Edward Tunour, Grantham, southwestern part of Lincolnshire. More to come. In 1592 a John Turner sold a messuage in Doncaster to William Bradforth and it is probable that the Mayflower Pilgrim was of the original Pilgrim band in 1610 emigrating to Leyden with Bradford and Brewster. John Turner, a merchant, was admitted burgess of Leyden that year. A John Turner was married at Whitechapel in 1615, where later Stephen Hopkins took a second wife. Several persons connected with the Pilgrims lived in that parish. end. This could be him if it was a second marriage. In another book it said that the children with no names given on the roster were under the age of 20. The James Turner that was Gov. and Senator of No. Carolina was stated as being a cousin of our Turners. Maybe William's cousin? There will be much written about him in No. Carolina history, but maybe someone already has his line done. He was born in Southampton Co., VA on Dec. 20, 1766. When very young his father moved them to Warren (then Bute)Co., Nor. Carolina. Well I have written all I have time for now, but if I remember any other stuff we found I will write you again later. We may go somewhere today and tomorrow, so look for me on Sat. maybe. But go ahead and send me mail as soon as you want, our plans may fall through. After reading your letter on James Turner's line, I looked back at the article I had told you about and found it mentioned Humphrey Turner there also. So I want to type more of it and let you read it for yourself and see if you can make any since of it. There are some discrepencies that occur according to your info, so I don't know which is the more reliable source. Here it is: The Turner name certainly carries with it the Brewster record, and as the various marriages make as many lines, I give it in the chart as sent to me: Humphrey Turner, died 1673; was of Scituate, Mass., in 1633. Married Lydia Garner. Their eldest son, John Turner, born in Eng. Nov. 12, 1645, married Mary Brewster, daughter of Jonathan Brewster and Lucretia, granddaughter of Elder William Brewster. Benjamin Turner, born March 5, 1650, died April 14, 1692, married Elizabeth Hawkins. Capt. Hawkins Turner, born Aug. 24,1704, in Scituate, Mass., married Lucy Starr, of New London, Conn., born July 18, 1707, died Mar. 16, 1809. Jonathan Starr, of New London, Conn., married daughter of Elizabeth Morgan, of Groton, Conn. Samuel Starr, son of Comfort Starr, married Hannah Brewster, daughter of Jonathan Brewster and Lucretia, granddaughter of Elder William Brewster. Many notes come to me from all quarters in regard to the Turner family. All will be useful to future historian. My attention was called to "Historical Collections of Grantham, Engaland," by Edmund Turnour, Grantham, southwestern part of Lincolnshire. Although the present generation spell the name Turnour, it seems from the book, to have been formerly Turnor or Turner. As this place was near the vicintiy of the other Pilgrims, it seems possible John Turner, of the Mayflower, may have come from here. In Dr. Eggleston's "Beginners of a Nation," published in 1897, on page 130, is reference to a book of Dr. Bound's on a stricter Sabbath. Page 139: "It is Thomas Rogers, the earliest opponent of the doctrine of Greenham and Bound, etc. Preface to Thirty-nine Articles, paragraph 20." Can this be Thomas Rogers, of the Mayflower? Mr. Alfred R. Turner, of Malden, Mass., who has stood bravely by both Turners and Rogerses, as a lineal descendant, sends the line of Humphrey Turner: Humphrey Turner and wife Lydia came to Plymouth in 1628 and settled in Scituate, near Coleman's Hills. They had John (1), John(2), Thomas(3), Daniel(4), Nathaniel(5), Joseph(6), Lydia(7), Mary(8). John(1) married Mary Brewster, daughter of Jonathan Brewster, and granddaughter to Elder William Brewster, Nov. 12, 1645. They had thirteen children. Joseph who married Bathsheba Hobart, had Bathsheba, Margaret. Ezekiel, who married Susanna Keney, had Ezekeil, Grace, Lucretia, Sarah, Ruth, Mary, Elizabeth, Lydia, Hannah, Susanna. John, who married Abigail Padeshall, had Richard, Abiel, John, Margaret, Lydia, Abigail. Elisha who married Elizabeth Jacob, had Elisha, Mary, Jael, Jane, Elizabeth, Mary. Benjamin who married Elizabeth Hawkins, had John, Joseph, Benjamin, William, Hawkins, Grace, Elizabeth. Jonathan who married first Martha Bisbee, second, Mercy Hatch, had Isaac, Ignatius, Jesse, Martha, Deborah, Keziah, Jonathan, Mary, Jemima, Ruth. Amos who married Mary Hiland, had Amos, Ezediel, Seth, Jane, Mary, Lydia, Anna. I am not informed in regard to the rest - Joseph, Lydia, Mary, Ruth, Isaac Grace. THE ABOVE IS AN EXCERPT FROM THE BOOK "SIGNERS OF THE MAYFLOWER COMPACT". PG. 22, JOHN TURNER, THE 22ND SIGNER. ==================================== Subj: BURNETT-TURNER-ROSS-VIA- Date: 96-04-06 09:14:25 EST From: 72650.74@compuserve.com (Philip A. Turner) I am looking for the ancestors of a William Turner who married a Tabitha Pruett. They both were born in Virginia in the 1780s and later moved to Switzerland County, IN where they raised their family and died. Recently, it has occurred to me that WEST Virginia was part of Virginia up until 1863. Is anyone out there researching the Turner family in West Virginia. If so, I would like to correspond with them. Thanks Philip Turner ============================= Philip: In a message dated 96-04-06 09:14:25 EST, you write: >William Turner who married a Tabitha Pruett. There were Pruetts in Tazewell County. Have you checked that county at all? I'll add your message to the next mailing. Have you tried Roots-L or WVA-L? Nyla =============================== Subj: Burnett Date: 96-04-09 16:46:34 EDT From: ekirkman@swva.net (Eunice B. Kirkman) File: FILE.RTF (15709 bytes) DL Time (28800 bps): < 1 minute Nyla, Do place me on your mailing list. I have a large number of surname files of the early pioneers of Patrick County, VA. Will be glad to send the list to anyone requesting information of Patrick County or Virginia ancestors. I am sending you, as an attachment, some very early Burnett settlers. I don't know how accurate the lineage is, however, if anyone seems familiar... I'll see what else I can find. One of my research focuses is on the Turner family. I have some fairly well documented files on two early settlers here, I think they were two distinct lines, that of James Turner, b. ca 1675-80 Augusta Co., VA, Baptist Minister, and Shadrach Turner, b. ca 1680-90 origin unknown (most likely Scotland). These branches do not match those you have. BUT the surnames that mentioned in last transmit match with surnames found in my files...VIA, BURNETT, TURNER, PHILPOTT, NOWLIN, LAWSON. Thanks, Eunice Kirkman ekirkman@swva.net =============================================================== NOTE: JUST REALIZED THAT I COULD NOT CONVERT THE FILE THAT EUNICE KIRKMAN HAD ATTACHED. I WILL INCLUDE THAT WITH THE NEXT MAILING IF POSSIBLE. NYLA =========================== Subj: TURNER mailing list Date: 96-04-09 09:35:42 EDT From: marockem@minot.ndak.net Please post with your TURNER mailing list, thanks. Looking for more information on this family: Lucinda TURNER b. 1866 in Jasper County (IL?) d. 1906 buried rural Rosehill, IL cemetery She married John Lee "Lee" CLINE in 1882, they had 8 children. She is the daughter of Chrisopher & Arminta (CUMMINS) TURNER. (They are both buried east of Rose Hill, IL). She had a sister, Jane, who is buried at rural Rose Hill, IL. Any information would be appreciated. Thank you. Annette (marockem@minot.ndak.net) ========================================== Subj: Turner newsletter Date: 96-04-10 13:40:03 EDT From: Pat-Chesney@easy.com (Pat Chesney) Hi, Nyla, Just wanted to let everyone know on Turner newsletter that I talked with my sister Jeanne last night and she found some information that points to our William S. Turner being William Suddarth Turner. So the following info that John Turner sent me from his Turner family history book is what I am going to pursue at this time. Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 07:50:14 -0500 From: johnt@fhouse.org Subject: Turner family To: pat-chesney@easy.com Hello again, Well I found another William, This is William Suddarth Turner married Elizabeth P. Smith and moved to Texas His father was John Turner Born in Virginia and died prior to 1820 and John father was Terisha Turner born 1705 probably England settled in Amherst County, Virginia and married Sarah Wimpy. I did find the Gov. James Turner he had three wifes Polly Anderson (2)Ann Cochran and (3)Elizabeth Johnston. The Book I am using is A History of the Turner Family by William A. Roskey - American genealogical Research institute, Washington D.C. James was from the Mass. Line of Turner and that is where you find the Brewsters. *** Also - I'm still pursuing the connection with James Turner the governor because of the statement that A.J. Sowell made in his Texas INdian fighter book about his mother Mary Turner Sowell saying James Turner the governor of NC was her great grandfather. I do not find the dates of her father and James to indictate that this is a true statement. But in reading in a book called TENN. COUSINs I read that James Turner the governor had a mother or grandmother that was also a Turner. So there could be a tie there to a whole different Turner family line. In the family line of James Turner or any other Turners connected in the Turner family book there is not one Terisha Turner mentioned. I did notice as I looked through the Turners in that book trying to find Terisha's name some Gilbert girls marrying Turners and naming their children Gilbert as a middle name. My William's son Calvin Turner named his first born Gilbert Jackson Turner. Also in talking with my sister Jeanne last night she read out of Sowells book where my Major William S. Turner was on the staff under Gen. Jackson. I didn't realize he was that close connection. Said he was shot with arrors in head and neck during the indian battles, and though wounded seriously survived. I need to look for books covering Jacksons military compaigns I guess. I wrote Jo after she sent me this note. Anyone know of connections between any of these families mentioned? I know there are some good family books on the Payne family. They might document a side family. I know of some Payne researchers I could write and ask. From: Jogt@aol.com Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 10:05:18 -0500 To: Pat-Chesney@easy.com Subject: Turner, Terisha I was just reading the compilation of Turner data on Chis Gaunt's page. I saw that you listed Terisha Turner as an ancestor. I wonder if you have any documentation of him before the mid 1700s? I have a few references for his wife and her family from Essex Co., but nothing pertaining to Terisha and her getting married. My line goes through James, s/o James, s/o Old Terisha. James died in Sumner Co., TN - but I don't know exactly when. His daughter, Eliz. married Simpson Payne there in 1824 and later when her mother, Lucy Ham Turner died her estate gives to "Simpson Payne, who married Eiz. the d/o the dec'd." several slaves. Eliz. also named her daughter Lucy Ham Payne. Convenient, huh? Are you aware that Sumner Co., TN has great archives, and will even do research for you? Jo Thiessen jogt@aol.com Thanks for any helps from Turner researchers. Terri Chesney Pat and Terri Chesney Rt. 5 Box 895 E Waco, Texas 76705 fax: (817)-829-0251 phone: (817)-829-0153 ============================ Subj: TURNER family Date: 96-04-07 15:24:53 EDT From: IRXP500@INDYVAX.IUPUI.EDU (JEFFERY A. DUVALL) I was given your name and e-mail address by Chris Gaunt, who informed me that I might be able to get some help on a TURNER family mystery that I am trying to solve. My gg-grandmother, Mrs. Henrietta TURNER-BLEDSOE KEMPER, was born in Owen Co., KY. Her mother was Mary Jane BLEDSOE and her father was Samuel TURNER. All I do know is that my gg-grandmother, Henrietta, was raised by a great-aunt and uncle, Robert and Mary "Polly" KEMPER SLAUGHTER. Jeff Duvall (irxp500@indyvax.iupui.edu) 920 E. Markwood Ave. Apt. A10 Indpls., IN 46227 (317) 786-4507 ===================================== NOTE: I HAVE DELETED A PORTION OF MR. DUVALL'S MESSAGE. IF YOU HAVE FURTHER INFORMATION ON Henrietta Turner-Bledsoe Kemper, PLEASE GET IN TOUCH WITH HIM DIRECTLY. THANK YOU. NYLA ===================================== Subj: Henrietta TURNER BLEDSOE KEMPER Date: 96-04-07 23:02:42 EDT From: IRXP500@INDYVAX.IUPUI.EDU (JEFFERY A. DUVALL) Nyla, Thanks for both your prompt reply to my "out-of-the-blue" message and for the offer to help. I would be delited to have you post an aol query (or whatever its called) and anything else you are willing to do. If it is possible, you could just have people send responses to me directly at my E-mail address rather than having to forward them to me, but you no doubt know more about the technology than I do--I am still at the "I'm so amazed that I figured out how to send e-mail" stage. Sorry about dropping off my gg-grandmother's dates--its been a long weekend I guess. They are as follows: Henrietta TURNER BLEDSOE was born in Poplar Grove, Owen Co., KY on 16-Dec-1846 and died in Louisville, KY on 14-Feb-1918. My impression is that her time in Louisville was rather brief and that she had been resident in Worthville, Carroll Co., KY for most of the latter half of her life. I am currently subscribed to the KYROOTS and VA-ROOTS lists--I believe that Chris Gaunt wrote to me in response to a posting that I ran on KYROOTS regarding Samuel TURNER. I am not subscribed to the other ROOTS list that you mentioned, however. Would you reccomend it? Thanks for your help and feel free to ask any other questions that you feel might be of any use in helping me to pin-down just who Samuel TURNER was. Jeff (irxp500@indyvax.iupui.edu) I do have one other odd bit of info which might, or might not, be of use: In the 1960s, a Mrs. Martha Reed Roberts of Ft. Thomas, KY ran a couple of queries in the journal "Kentucky Ancestors" in which she was seeking information on my gg-grandmother Henrietta "Eddie/Etta" TURNER BLEDSOE and her family. Unfortunately, I ran across these several decades too late--I wrote the address but Mrs. Roberts was long gone--and have wondered ever since who Mrs. Roberts was and why she was trying to contact my family. =========================== The end.