In Search of a Butt-Flap        Posted by:  M. K.
9/17/99    01:30 PM

I  play Everquest.

I understand the market for games like these. It's marketed for 16 year old boys: The ranger that I created is dressed in a leather bustier and a thong. The leather pants I bought look like chaps when worn by a female character. Correspondingly, male rangers are *not* dressed in little leather pouches with bare chests. What a surprise.

Of course, I get to hear how fine my caboose looks while I'm kneeling to loot a corpse. Every time I play. The magic using types get to wear robes. I'm jealous. I'd settle for a butt-flap.

It's hard to be truly offended - if you've gamed long enough, you come to get used to it. Look around: It's in all the fantasy art. Try to find a female warrior figurine that's actually wearing useful armor. It's hard to remain offended after all these years but I have gotten tired of it.

Frankly, I don't want to broach the how perpetuattion of women stereotypes: It doesn't matter whether we kick ass or not, as long as we look good doing it. It's a subject far bigger than computer gaming and we're fixing that by living our lives day by day.

Do any of y'all play Everquest? What do you think of the stereotypical game-look of female characters? Tight and/or tiny little outfits, leaving little to the imagination? Is it worth our time and effort to tell Verdant that the we would have liked a *choice* in how revealingly our characters are dressed? Or do I create a character on a Player-vs-Player server and just beat the crap outta the next guy that says 'Nice view! :) '?
 
 

Untitled        Posted by:  C. L. in response to In Search of a Butt-Flap
9/17/99    01:48 PM

I understand how you're feeling, M.; I've been gaming for years and just when I think I've gotten over being offended by anything so rote as scantily-clad female game characters, I see something like EverQuest, or Deathtrap Dungeon (a PC game that was grilled for its female character's lack of costume). True a lot of fantasy art favors the swordwomen in chainmail bikinis theme, but having just come back from GenCon for the umpteenth year in a row, I have to say that there's more art dealing with women in all kinds of clothing than there is dealing with naked or bikini-clad women.  Sure those elements are still there in force, but there's also quite a bit of artwork that presented not only non-traditional body types (a little thinner or fatter than the usual Barbie Doll proportions), but women /clothed/ (yet still looking quite formidable, tough, and intentionally erotic).

As far as the computer gaming industry goes, I think it will get worse before it gets better. Having gamed online for years in text-only mediums, and having heard the kinds of comments women who frequented "social" chat rooms got when their only visible female attributes online were a floating head with a ponytail and a female name, I can say that when Ultima Online and EverQuest were becoming popular, I was just waiting to hear exasperation like yours. The fact that it's supported by the gaming companies themselves (who are either so completely market-driven that they're in tune with the sexist attitudes of fantasy women's fashions and deliberately exploit the trends to gain players, or are staffed by nothing more than grown-up versions of the players who tell you your polygon-lite character has a nice ass) is inexcusable.

That's why I think you should write them an email or letter. You paid (and presumably continue to pay) money to buy their game and play it. Obviously you enjoy the storyline. What would have been hurt by either providing a less T&A choice of attire for a female character, or changing the get-up totally to have one less-risque choice? Their design and programming time went into creating a deliberately ridiculous model (and knowing the kinds of players they were likely to get, they /had/ to be either aware of or counting on eliciting the very comments you find annoying), and they deserve to be scolded like children. Not to turn it into anything more than a minor deal, but the fact that the company could play the market like this and deliberately ignore (and possibly offend) women as potential gamers (we don't play? we don't count as part of the market?  so why not just offend us in the quest for more fifteen year old boys?) /is/ annoying and deserves a response.

c.

Untitled        Posted by:  G. R. in response to In Search of a Butt-Flap
9/17/99    02:24 PM

Hi M.!

Even though I never played "Everquest", can understand perfectly your feelings.

The fantasy art is full of gorgeus female warriors with a "magic earring" that gives them all the protection they need, making clothes completely useless. Ah! they can also wear a biiiiiig sword, but no shields that can cover an inch of their "fabulous" anatomy.  The stereotype is so fixed in our minds that even female artists paint their women warriors in that way.

So, the 1000000 dolars question is: What can we do about it?  E-mailing PC games makers, just to let them know that women ALSO play the games, would be an option.  Start a boycot campaign.  Don't try to match the stereotype in masquerades, conventions or RPG tables.  I don't know. Looks like it will be a long, and probably fruitless work, but if we start, perhaps our grand daughters won't have to freeze in cold days trying to dress like a heroine ;-)

Greetings from the south of the world!
G. R.
Buenos Aires, Argentina
 

Knock 'em dead!        Posted by:  S. K. in response to In Search of a Butt-Flap
9/17/99    04:33 PM

How obnoxious! Writing e-mail to teh game company is certainly an option, and likely a good one. What I would rather do is make it part of my character's purpose in life to trounce any and all who are so busy looking at my ass that they can't see the steel of my sword, untill they are decapatated.
Off to play Mage tonight.
S.

You have accomplished something!        Posted by:  M. S. in response to In Search of a Butt-Flap
9/17/99    07:56 PM

After I read your mail. I for one am NOT going to buy that game.

But there are other sides to this 'problem'. I mean, I can understand the affect these pictures has on men.  For myself, I don't mind watching fantasy-type pictures of heroic men with lots of muscles and the whole package.

There is some need we humans have that all advertising -companies use. Sex is the easiest way to market something. Why? beats me!
 

Untitled        Posted by:  L. T. in response to In Search of a Butt-Flap
9/20/99    02:40 PM

M. K.'s comment about Ever Quest and Fantasy characters in general is very valid. I too play Ever Quest (mostly female characters) and am annoyed by the fact that you have so little choices in clothing. Even when you buy more clothing that is supposedly covering it does not show up on your character. I too have a 1/2 elf Ranger and despite the fact that she has a full set of armour, a cloak and a hood you see almost none of it on the actual character.

To be honest M. I don't know what complaining would get us very far unless we can find a whole bunch of women willing to sign a petition about it. I know I would be happy to have my name on the list but I don't know a whole lot of women who actually play Ever Quest. Most of the players I know are male. Figures don't it. :)!

--
L. T.
"Duct Tape is like the Force there's a light side and a dark side and it keeps the universe together"

Untitled        Posted by:  R. S. in response to In Search of a Butt-Flap
9/22/99    07:25 AM

Well I play Dragon Warriors (medieval setting), AD&D, and Shadowrun. With any of these games seeing I am the only female player amongst five men, it's sometimes hard to plau female characters, but I've never had the problem that you're experiencing. In these systems all the 'warrior' classes wear exactly the same thing if they want to, it's only the clothes out of armour that differ.

I always like to put revealing clothes on good looking female characters 'cause it keeps the men's mind on that and therefore distracts them but it can also lead to some intersting inter player events. For example one of my characters got into a fight with one of men's characters 'cause they were shouting out "Reveal thy breasts" (they were Lords), unfortunately i understood, and a fight broke out, and my character almost got hung for 'attacking' a noble before we even got the adventure started.

However this is I feel a small price to pay especially if I (as in my choice) dress them like that. Your situation would drive me nuts cause you have no choice and they are constantly commenting on the attire. I guess there's not really much you can do if you want to stay with the gaming group and in that adventure.....

Well good luck in future campaigns.

R.
 

Untitled        Posted by I. M. in response to In Search of a Butt-Flap
9/22/99    11:14 PM

I don't play Everquest so I'm not sure why the dress of characters is a predetermined thing. I can say that some of the minitures companies dress characters that way. The stereotype has been around forever, probably because it is a mostly male industry.

What can I say? I always describe my characters clothing and needless to say I don't wear a thong into battle.

"Daytona"

PvP?        Posted by:  R. D. in response to In Search of a Butt-Flap
9/29/99    08:58 PM

I play Dragon Realms. My husband in Dragon Realms also plays EverQuest. His RL wife tells me all the shenanigans he gets into, including the time some floozie named Lollie kissed him.

So, if you run into 'Lollie' tell her Dash is taken!

Untitled        Posted by:  L. P. in response to In Search of a Butt-Flap
10/4/99    03:53 PM

Hi, yes, I am sure we could all vent for hours about this....

>Is it worth our time and effort to tell Verdant that the we would have
>liked a *choice* in how revealingly our characters are dressed?

probably better in the long run but.....

>Or do I create a character on a Player-vs-Player server and just beat the
>crap outta the next guy that says 'Nice view! :) '?

I do love this chocie!

L.
 

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